“Just let ME get my achievement “ says one person.
But it’s not just you I explain, it’s every single person queuing for WSG this week.
If this achievement means so much to you – do it in a premade, where you are not inflicting your decision to stuff up a game of pvp because you have to have that point. It’s not like you stick around for after you get the achievement – you’re the first to leave the bg because you came for what you wanted.
“Don’t blame me, it’s blizzards fault”
No. It’s your fault for not taking your achievements serious enough to actually think ahead and plan for this. Its easier done when you have a whole team wanting to achieve what you do – or shock horror you can actually earn it as intended!
The Horde are not your friends. Alliance if your horde are not your Allies. We are opposing factions. We kill each other. Yes?
I am not going to be nice, and say sure. Mr 1067 player for this week so far. You are special. Im going to wait patiently for 25 min to win a game of WSG because your playing lets see who can drop the flag for the hordies.
Can I stop playing WSG this week because my game has been interfered with to the extent that its impossible to play a game – sure, but it’s more fun to try and round up the people who actually care about winning, care enough to try, care enough to play, and do it as it should be done.
If you are collaborating with the enemy so you can get another 10 points then do you even deserve to call it an achievement. Your cheating.
Yes you are. You are cheating
You haven’t achieved anything – your kidding your self if you think you have. You’ve not chased down an enemy flag carrier and killed him – and if that’s how you got your achievement then you have earned, and played it as it should be.
Yes I’m Mad.
Provided by 
Pugnacious Priest's Warcraft Blog 
Soory, Pugnacious, but I’ll have to tell you what it seems like every BG player has told me this week:
I don’t care.
I picked up the flag in EotS yesterday, and did it the right way (for an arcane mage, at least) – stealth and guile. I ran for it, and got nailed because my teammates refused to help me with my orphan out.
Yeah, they just stood there. Thanks, guys.
So forgive me if any shred of sympathy I may have started with really isn’t there anymore. I geared for PvP with this achievement in mind, I’ve done my best to get up to speed on the BGs I’d be in, and I’ve tried to fulfill my end of the implied bargain by actually playing instead of whining “achieve please”.
I’m giving thought to automatically vote-kicking anyone in a dungeon group that I catch wearing PvP gear. See, I don’t care what your reasons are for being there – gear, emblems, whatever. If you don’t want me in your BG, then you can go take a flying leap if you think I’m going to let you into my dungeon run.
Pretty big difference there. Are they not taking part in the heroic? Are they just here to mine, or take screenshots, or do something else entirely unrelated to the actual objective of the place? Because that’s what School of Hard Knocks seekers are doing in bgs.
PVPers have no problem with PVE’ers in battlegrounds if they’re actually participating and doing their job. Maybe they’re farming honor for gems, it’s all good. Same as a PVPer stepping into heroics for badges.
It’s when players go into battlegrounds and whine LET ME GET THE ACHIEVEMENT, PLZ PLZ PLZZZZZZ and ruin the entire experience that people get mad at them.
But props on gearing for PVP and doing it the right way. When you get the achievement, you’ll have earned it. That’s the way it’s supposed to be done.
See the real achievement is communicating with your team for a common objective, and good on you for trying – i don’t understand why people aren’t organizing realm premades for this though – your only making it harder for yourselves by trying to satisfy your individual needs – and interfering with people trying to do the right thing.
and as for the PVP gear in PVE – thats a little harsh. It would be like kicking tanks for wearing white gear – because they don’t have the right colour purple. Sure the Pve’rs get annoyed with someone in full PVP gear but I can’t see you getting the vote to kick through on that basis
Thing is, I’d bet reasonable money that the reason they weren’t helping you wasn’t because they were upset that you were going for the achievement, but that they were hoping you’d drop the flag so *they* could get the achievement.
That being the problem with the whole setup.
Ugh this is why I won’t do this achievement, even though it’s the last little one on my ‘long strange trip’.
Not only does it frustrate me as a non pvp-er as I find pvp difficult enough, my pvp gear consists of 2 pieces with resilience, and I have NO idea what I’m doing that would actually assist the rest of my team. Sure I could research all this but I hate the idea of having to act against the overall objective of the battleground to achieve my selfish personal goal. It’s not like, say, the dungeon based event achievements require you to ninjapull a mob and get your healer killed while /dancing with your orphan. It frustrates other achievement hunters all trying to do the same thing with very limited resources. It sure as hell frustrates the regular pvp-ers who just want to get on with their game.
I’m with you, Len – I *hate* having to do the flag capture tasks for Hard Knocks. Others, not so much. Capture a node in WG? No problem, just a matter of being quick out the gate and knowing where you’re going – anybody can do that. Assault a tower in AV? Yeah, same thing, really – just speed and knowing where you’re going. After that, it’s just plain old PvP.
Capture a flag? Riiiiiiight.
I’m doing this on my main, she’s a *mage*. Unless everyone agrees to completely change the way the BG gets played, then there’s *no* way I’m going to get to carry the flag. Capture it? As a relatively unskilled PvP player? Ha! Good luck with that.
Blizzard has effectively told me that if I want this achievement, I don’t just need to bend the rules, I need to torture them into some sort of weird four-dimensional shape that makes your eyes water when you look at it. That’s fine with me. I’m sorry that you have to put up with a week of nonsense because of it, but *I* *am* *going* *to* *get* *this* *achievement*, even if it means I have to fight my own faction as well as the Horde.
Now… tell me that’s not a PvP attitude 🙂
Heh my main is a mage too – and a damn squishy one in pve gear!
My full blown stubborn-ness is now in the way of a new shiny drake (that I’d never use because I’m too stubborn to use anything but regular mounts in protest at all the posers who hang around on mammoths by mailboxes… ur anyway…) as I just will not do this achievement.
For me it’s not about bending rules, it’s about making the lives of other players more difficult (and not in the intended PVP way) for my own selfish needs. Having to wander into a BG, do my best to kill stuff and not be killed and get an achievement for that? Fine. Having to work against my own team? Not fine.
I’d like the achievement for ‘completeness’ and the work I’ve put into the other world events, but I’d rather play the game I enjoy and have no achievement than force myself to do something I really dislike both in practice and principle.
It can be done! – Just with a little more organization – if there are so many out there wanting this/ needing this then why aren’t you banding together to get it done.
Yet if it was a PvE raiding achievement somebody needed to gain a 310% mount, most would have no problem helping them out.
Sorry, I don’t buy the attitude. It’s 1 week out of 52 for someone who may have no other way to get a faster flyer. For the most part, they don’t want to be there any more than you want them there.
WTB some tolerance, pst.
easier to stop playing while it’s on – and no one asks for help – or sets up a plan. The people doing it are their own worst enemies too – more interesting in getting what they need, and leaving the BG as soon as they are done.
They leave as soon as they’re done because everyone is so hostile. Would you hang around, faced with such vitriol?
I enjoy BG’s as an occasional diversion, even though I can’t really PvP my way out of a wet paper bag, not 1v1. I usually just stand to the side healing for the 13.4 secs the enemy lets me live. I refuse to do this achievement because of the crap and hatred poured on you the moment you pull out an orphan in a BG. No mount is worth that.
Umm, I rather dispute that.
If you were pugging Ulduar for the weekly, and there was one guy who needed Steelbreaker for their protodrake, are you honestly saying you would (a) be totally okay to help them with it and (b) be totally okay if they just ran off and aggroed the Iron Council without consulting you?
All the people who don’t PvP regulary have to deal with the inflated egos of the PvPers. That’s the real travesty.
some people like doing both – and its not ego wanting to play the game as intended.
After spending 2 hours last night trying to win a BG… yes win not get an achievement… I gave up and went to bed. Freaking EotS… I got that twice. I’d run up to a node kill 3-4 horde… get killed by respawns, look back for reinforcements… and they are all standing around the flag spawn.
I would be on the losing side… but still have the highest kills in a BG and it didn’t matter because I was the only person there trying to actually win the game.
I mean sure… I know there are just as many people on the opposite faction trying to get the achievement… but I just want to win! I want my 25 arena points for the day so I can call it good.
Its like queuing for a heroic and every single group you get in insists on doing every possible achievement for every boss.
Been looking for a place to vent at achievement hunters, so I’m glad for this post. I haven’t wanted to feel like I’m trolling by commenting on one of the thousand blogs that are whinging about being “forced” to do this. Do achievement hunters ever stop and think about what they’re doing? I just don’t get it. They’re determined to do something they hate, and interfere in other content people normally find entertaining so they hate it too, and for what?
For an achievement? Like PP said, they haven’t achieved a damn thing, so it has no value in and of itself.
Achievement points? They don’t even do anything.
E-peen? Does anyone actually look upon players with more or different achievements as being better than they are? That may be the goal, but does that ever actually happen? When confronted with someone who has more achievements, do we say “this person is a better player” or do we say “this person has more time and/or is luckier”? I think it’s the latter most of the time, and especially for this particular achievement, so why would anyone believe that getting this achievement impresses anyone?
Or maybe they’re doing it for the mount? A mount which is barely faster than the normal epic flyer, a mount which I highly doubt anyone even gets much use out of anymore. Especially with all the various portals and ways to instantly access the vast majority of content in the game now. I’ll almost guarantee that almost everyone with a 310 mount has spent more time getting that mount than they’ll ever save by flying a little faster.
I guess I can’t begrudge people finding ways to spend their time, but I just don’t understand why someone would make not just their own self but a bunch of other people unhappy, just because someone has thrown something of dubious value in their path. It’s not the PvPers fault, it’s not even Blizzard’s fault. We choose what we do, and it boggles my mind that anyone would spend their leisure time doing something they hate.
Busket – it doesn’t matter what my reasons are for playing. If Blizzard were to shut down their servers tomorrow, we’d be left with the exact same thing: nothing except the memories of what we did in the game.
So I think my desire to acquire a useless achievement are exactly equal to your desire to acquire another useless win in a BG.
You’re not reading my post, you’re reading somebody else’s post and projecting it onto mine. I quote myself: I don’t begrudge anyone spending their time how they want. But I still don’t get why you’d do something that you don’t find fun, and make an activity that _others_ usually have fun doing not fun, in your leisure time. Can you explain that to me? No one ever tries, they just stamp their feet and say “let me do what I want to do”. Why so hellbent on increasing the sum total of misery in the world (of Warcraft)?
It’s not the chasing of the achievement that’s the frustrating part – but they are supposed to be a measure of overcomming something difficult / challenging. it’s how they are doing. Watching person after person cycle through the BG getting what they are after, leave only to be replaced with a” But I need it too” Where were all these people last year when they could have done it then?
Read my latest blog post, Pugnacious… I had a blast in EotS last night, even got to organize some battles myself (badly, I’ll admit). Despite trying hard to contribute to the team effort (wining the BG), achievement seekers were still being excoriated for daring to show up, and “real” PvP’ers were refusing to help us accomplish our goals. Quid pro quo? Ever hear of that, guys? We help you, you help us? Oh, no, sorry – I guess the “honor” of being allowed in the battleground is all we should expect.
Pugnacious – my apologies for the language in the last response; I’m unfairly impugning the character of a lot of skilled, friendly and helpful PvP players there, and I shouldn’t have painted my negative picture with such a broad brush. I realize that my BG experiences this week are hardly typical, and I do have to admit that as annoying and discouraging as it is this year, it’s still much better than it was last time around
Amazingly, there ARE some of us PvE types who are trying not to ruin the bgs in order to get our achieves. Case in point, I took a group of guildmates with me, and we set out to get our achieves WHILE winning the bg.
But here’s the thing: We endured abuse from the PvPers and the PvEers alike. The PvP folks cursed at us for wanting our achievements, and the PvE folks cursed at us for trying to complete actual bg objectives. I happen to enjoy multiple facets of the game, including PvP, and I wanted this holiday for the sake of completion. Having people spit on me for trying to get my achievement and win at the same time? Yeah, screw those people.
There was never any pleasing either group with this holiday. It was just another excuse for people to be absolute asshats to each other.
I have no problem with say, letting someone else grab the flag instead if they need it, or allowing an enemy to exist for the extra second needed to grab the flag and die. If there is no negative effect on winning the BG, go ahead. But I don’t want to see all this carebear nonsense of trading caps and whatnot.
I haven’t done the achievements yet for this one. World events kinda lost interest for me – and from memory it was Children’s Week last year that turned me off them.
I am not sure if I want to try it again this year. As a clothie warlock – despite my 1k resilience and stuff – it still feels wrong to try and cap flags.
Hopefully someone will see my gear and spec and assist me with it seeing as once I cap what I need to I will participate in the BG properly (as noted it’s not like I am not capable).
I think it’s partially Blizzard’s fault but at the same time I suppose the idea is that it gets people who normally wouldn’t PVP interested in it.
Hiya Mad.
Yes, I do battlegrounds for the achievements. I will bring friends, ask for support, play nice with the opposition to get this achievement.
I don’t really want to be in your battleground anymore than you want me. This week, I was selfish. Now I have my achievement, I wont darken your doorstop again (at least untill the next time Blizzard send me to a BG for yet another achievement).
bringing friends – communication BOTH are not what they majority of these people are doing.
I guess you could say I cheated, but to be fair the wsg I went into had both teams just standing in their bases. I went for the horde flag and was killed very quickly because of 10 horde gathered around it, and absloutly no support from my team.
As for EotS, alliance suck at it on Bloodlust, I fought for the bases but when it became clear that we were done for because our team just humped up at one tower I went for the flag.
AB, I almost always get the first cap, so nothing new there, and then I usually defend it, so I played my normal round.
AV would be the only one that I actually cheated it. The whole 1/10 chance of getting the cap is retarded to me, so I took advantage of a nice horde who was allowing alliance to get the achive, and then I stayed for the victory by the Alliance by going in and healing up the tank on Drek.
In short, yea, we’re enemies, but even on christmas the axis and allies stopped shooting and came out of their trenches. How is this any different?
Love this! Just posted on the issue myself. And if you haven’t read it, Tam’s post takes the viewpoint I would love to see people adopt.
If you want the achievement so badly and you don’t normally PvP, get a premade group together and just try to do the achievement. Then you’re only screwing up yourselves.
-RBK
Actually, mages are some of the best flag carriers around… Invis to flag, if you can grab it Frost Nova, blink, mana shield… Any of those help out. Best flag carriers I’ve seen in WSG are droods and mages.
Someone said it perfectly though. If I *dare* to try and come into a raid in PvP gear, even one or two pieces, there is nothing but vitriol and hatred. AND you’ll gear check me and either not invite or kick me from the raid. In a BG anyone can enter, regardless of gear, skill or knowledge. But you wouldn’t think twice about booting someone from a raid that “just wanted the axe from Marrowgar” if you didn’t like their gear, or they caused a wipe…
I do both PvE and PvP. I’m not excellent in either, but I do a good job and I’m usually in the top tier of people trying. And I learned a LOT about reflexes for my Disc priest healing from doing PvP, thanks very much.
And for “one week of the year”, the PvPers still have their own goals, and are trying to get gear, honour, achieves, etc. Being considerate both ways would help everyone out. Cap the flag, then stay and heal the crap out of someone or defend a node. WITH your orphan out, just to make a point. Not all PvE folks suck and are screwing up BG’s, and not all PvPers are giant ePeen asshats.
RBK
Took this post with a grain of salt, we all know you are going for Justicar.
But consider this, instead of begging all PVE players to congregate in a premade so your rep farming goes faster, take your own advice and make one yourself.
Justicar follows the principles of pvp – And a premade of an organized force v unorganized force is not real pvp I don’t love bging for rep farming or honor farming – not chasing justicar just for points it will happen eventually – it’s not meant to be farmed in a week
What is the achievement they’re trying to get anyway?
School of hard knocks you need to perform certain actions in different bg’s with your orphan out
This is mostly directed at those who are complaining that either this achievement is too hard to do or unfair to the other players if you do it.
I am a PVEer. I wanted this achievement and I had a couple guildies who also needed it as well as a random guy who wanted some honour. We queued up for all of the BGs required for it in order and got the achievements for everyone without an issue.
If you simply get 5 competent people together and actually try to do the achievements they are not hard. We did all of them in about 90 minutes for all 4 people who needed them. None of us BG a lot, most of us were wearing 0-2 pvp pieces. We also didn’t gunk up the BG for the regular PVPers either. Killing flag carriers in WSG is useful! Just because we took turns returning the flag after mauling them does not negate the usefulness of denying the flag to the enemy. Same with EotS, we got two nodes capped and then ran the flag, dropping it for each other as necessary.
If you insist on doing group pvp activities by yourself you are going to end up frustrated and ineffectual. If on the other hand you show some initiative and get a group with similar goals together none of the BG holiday achievements are hard at all.